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 liliaeth | |
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I don't like crossdressing in fic, or drag as a Halloween or entertainment thing in real life. Not because I don't think it's sexy or funny, I don't, but that's a personal matter instead of a value judgement. My issue with it is simple. I find it insulting. If it were up to me, men should be allowed to wear dresses and skirts and whatever.I'd prefer it, if they wore stuff that actually looked good on them and didn't add fake breasts, but they should be able to wear it. In the same manner that women are now allowed to wear pants and suits. As a normal part of life. Crossdressing and drag denigrates that. It basically says that socalled 'women''s clothing is inferior or 'funny' or 'weird' or 'fetish' like. It's like people dressing up as stereotypical Indians because it's exotic and weird. If people wore traditional Native American clothing (and yes, I'm well aware of just how huge a group of different styles I'm talking about, there's dozens if not hundred of tribes, all with their own styles and traditions), it shouldn't be because they're trying to dress up, but because they find the clothing in question attractive. If a man wants to wear a dress, he should be able to do so, without pretending he's a woman. (unless we're talking about a man who identifies as a woman and is merely trying to express their appearance in the manner they identify mentally. That's different cause those are women who just happen to be born with the appearance of a man. Not their fault and if they want to look like the gender they identify with, then that's their business. But when you've got a frat boy dressing up as a girl, because it's funny, then he's basically insulting women. He's bringing himself down for a moment to be 'the other', not because he wants to identify with them or know what it's like to be a woman, but because he's mocking them, because he is 'othering' them. Sorry, I'm bad at expressing myself on these kind of matters. I just find it wrong that we live in a world where 'female clothing' is somehow considered inferior to 'male clothing'. Where it's ok for a girl to wear pants, cause she'd be rising up to a male level. But if a boy wore a dress, he'd be making a fool of himself. Kinda like how a girl who became a mechanic is seen as rising up the ladder, but a boy who wants to be a homemaker is often looked down upon, 'because that's not a typically male profession' It's all in how we express ourselves to the world, do we say that the positions of males and females (and whatever gender you identify yourself as) are equal, or is there a ladder where one is just a wee bit superior to the other and if one on top of the ladder pretends to be the other, then it's 'funny'. or mockworthy like pretending to be a dog, something that can't be taken serious. Tags: rant
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From: liliaeth |
Date:
November 14th, 2010 10:09 am (UTC)
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Not disagreeing*g*, there's plenty of men who look awesome in a dress, the problem is when they start adding the fake boobs. (not that there aren't some who can't pull it off, though I honestly don't think that Jensen or Jared are amongst them, doubt that anyone looking at them while dressed up as women, would think, 'wow those are hot chicks'
I can't begin to count the amount of fics where an adult Dean dresses up like a girl and guys keep hitting on them and not even realizing he's male. He's pretty, but he still clearly looks like a man.
(of course I did just recently read a pretty ridiculous fic where Buffy and Faith dressed up as Sam and Dean for a Halloween party. And Sam and Dean happened to be there as well. And not only did one girl actually take Buffy to be a guy, but worse than that, when faced with the real Dean, she actually confused the two.
I mean, seriously, Buffy's what 5 ft tall, not much more than that, Dean's over 6'2", the girl would have to be blind to confuse the two of them.
Edited at 2010-11-14 10:13 am (UTC)
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I totally agree with most points you're making. Sadly, in this day and age a man who dresses in "women's" clothes would never be taken seriously. It's, as you said, considered degrading, while the other way round is considered perfectly fine nowadays. And the reason behind it is that women had to actually fight for their rights. It was women who had an active interest to be treated as any man would. I suspect as long as women don't have a better, enviable (or at least completely equal) status in society things won't change on the clothing front, either.
That said, I don't quite agree that men enjoy dressing up as a woman to ridicule only. Not in every case. Every carnival season I see boys dressing up as women and in most cases they try to look pretty. Yes, they do add the fake boobs and everything, but I think they honestly enjoy going through life as a woman for once. They shave their legs, they love the tights and they ususally put a lot of effort into their make-up. And every once in a while you see those boys who try to rebel with a kilt, insisting that that's the only thing they are ever going to wear from now on. I think it's their way of genderbending in our rigid society...
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While I don't think all female drag is misogynist - some of it deconstructs male and female binaries in a really interesting way, some of it is a genuine homage to women or a particular woman - the most common public manifestation is what you're talking about here.
Where I live, everyone dresses pretty much the same - jeans, work shirt, boots, maybe a woollen jumper and beanie if it's cold or a t-shirt and cap if it's hot. That's just "work", not male or female, and many have dressed like that for 50 years or more. And still, when the teenage boys want to do something stupid, they dress up a dead kangaroo in women's clothing because that's hilarious. Or they steal their sister's clothing. It's transgressive, but I would not be surprised if they turned on anyone who is actually transgressive, especially men. There are 5 lesbians in my town of 800 people, and no out gay men.
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From: liliaeth |
Date:
November 14th, 2010 07:00 pm (UTC)
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True there's exceptions to every rule. And I even think that most of the guys who dress up as women for a joke, don't even intend to be insulting. To them it's just some 'funny' thing to do, they don't think about it, either of what it means, or what it says about women.
Society is a huge part of the problem in that, we're almost trained to find the idea of a man in a dress, funny. When little boys want to dress up in pretty frilly dresses, they're often treated as if there's something wrong with them for wanting to be the princess for a change. Where as a little girl in a Batman costume is considered adorable.
It starts with Bugs Bunny and it keeps on going. And it's one of the hardest things to stop, because most people don't even realize what they're doing, either to their children or to themselves.
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From: elisi |
Date:
November 16th, 2010 12:07 pm (UTC)
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Just to compare, those are two Black Petes with a Sinterklaas which is a sight you see all around Belgium from about nowember to the fifth of december.Can I ask, do the black Petes have to be white people in blackface, or could they equally well be actual black people? I'm curious, because Dames can only be played by men. They're almost... a third sex? That sounds bizarre, but they're somewhere in the middle, something quite unique. Thinking about it, then I know that there are many problems with men in drag (excluding Dames), and misogyny, but OTOH then I think people should wear whatever they're comfortable with. Yes, straight, cis-gendered men and women are different from each other, but there are an awful lot of people who don't feel comfortable in either box. Look at f.ex. Grayson Perry. Clearly he is not... normal, but his choice to dress up as a 7 year old girl is his alone.
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